Weird Machinery

[Tim Gibbs]

In 1920 Henry Ford bought a yacht from the US Navy and named it Yankee Clipper. He had the steam recip machinery removed and replaced it with a Sun-Doxford . It was a 330SB4 engine which consisted of two 330 mm bore engines with aluminium columns and entablature mounted on a cast iron bedplate. It produced 1500 bhp at 200 rpm and each crankshaft appeared to drive a separate propeller although that must have been very difficult hydrodynamically as the props would have been very close together - or even overlapping. Or could it be that that the two shafts were combined in a gearbox near the stern to drive a single prop as the original steam engine probably did? Does anyone know?

[BobClay]

Now this is what I'd call a 'Weird Machine.'

It makes me happy that there are people in the world crazy enough to build something like this.

https://youtu.be/IvUU8joBb1Q

[Engine Serang]

It's a Babbage music centre. (Remember the 3 in 1)?

[Tim Gibbs]

And then there is this gem . A three throw crank with the side cranks connected to the the lower pistons of two cylinders and the centre crank connected to a transvers beam at the top connecting the top pistons of those two cylinders.
Unsurprisingly it was a Doxford concept design and unsurprisingly it didn't get beyond the drawing board.

[Tim Gibbs]

Originally Posted by Tim Gibbs

And then there is this gem . A three throw crank with the side cranks connected to the the lower pistons of two cylinders and the centre crank connected to a transvers beam at the top connecting the top pistons of those two cylinders.
Unsurprisingly it was a Doxford concept design and unsurprisingly it didn't get beyond the drawing board.

I have a drawing but I can't upload it despite it meeting all the site's criteria. Also, log in "remember me " has stopped working. Anybody any ideas?

[Varley]

Have you recently set your browser to delete cookies on exit?

(Your description, though, conjures an image of wonder despite absence of upload).

[Tim Gibbs]

Originally Posted by Varley

Have you recently set your browser to delete cookies on exit?

(Your description, though, conjures an image of wonder despite absence of upload).

I haven't knowingly changed anything David but it is an early edition of Windows10 and it's quite unstable. Will have a look.
The Double Doxford was proposed with 850 mm bore cylinders!

[Tim Gibbs]

Restart has fixed the image problem and here it is in all it's glory.
Computer still can't remember me

[Makko]

I feel for the opposed piston, Doxford, people! I only have seen one opposed piston B&W in an ED boat, docked in Huskisson. I think it may have been Pegu or Deido, but I cannot remember.
Rgds.
Dave

[rogd]

Thank the good Lord I was only a lecky!!

[Tim Gibbs]

Originally Posted by Makko

I feel for the opposed piston, Doxford, people! I only have seen one opposed piston B&W in an ED boat, docked in Huskisson. I think it may have been Pegu or Deido, but I cannot remember.
Rgds.
Dave

Purists would say the B&W wasn't a proper O/P engine cos the exhaust piston was connected to an eccentric so couldn't transmit meaningful torque to the crankshaft. So it was really a 2-strole with a piston exhaust valve.

[Makko]

Thanks for the clarification, Tim! My Dad sailed with them on Blueys. Then again, during his time at Odyssey, when the fleet was massive, he got to work on every class, motor/turbine/steam recip, coal/FO, even standing by overnight on a Scotts'-Still. Now, that was a weird piece of kit!
Rgds.

[Engine Serang]

Your father deserves a medal. No man should have been exposed to all the results of Marshall Meek's fertile brain, indeed an unusual and painful experience.
I'm scaling the Doxford attachment and will compare with those in CC Pounder and John Lamb, a fruitful and enjoyable mornings work until the Sunday Papers arrive.

[Tim Gibbs]

Originally Posted by Makko

Thanks for the clarification, Tim! My Dad sailed with them on Blueys. Then again, during his time at Odyssey, when the fleet was massive, he got to work on every class, motor/turbine/steam recip, coal/FO, even standing by overnight on a Scotts'-Still. Now, that was a weird piece of kit!
Rgds.

I thought a Scott-Still probably trumps anything else that made it into production. Although maybe a double acting 4-stroke might run it a close second? And there there was the free-piston gasifier ...... !

[Malcolm G]

Found this on the Still Steam-Diesel engine - Yes that definitely qualifies as weird...

http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/P...till/still.htm

[Makko]

There were two versions of Scotts'-Stills: One, diesel above/steam below and the other Diesel, first cylinders and then three steam reciprocating cylinders. That is the ship my Dad worked by on. Both had an auxiliary turbo generator. The problem was, they would turn something on, and the genny would go south, quickly. My Dad's experience was with the Donkey Boiler to keep power on,urged to,"Keep 'er in de blud, Lar!!".

One ship was Dolius (I think Diesel then steam cylinders). I cannot remember the other (Atreus??). Only two were built but soon converted. The next "occurrence" to Marshall Meek were the extremely high pressure steam ships......... Nuff said!

Rgds.
Dave

[Makko]

Originally Posted by Malcolm G

Found this on the Still Steam-Diesel engine - Yes that definitely qualifies as weird...

http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/P...till/still.htm

Excellent link, Malcolm. Thank you! So Eurybates, it was. Yes, six diesel cylinders and two steam. As I said, my father had the privilege of working on all the classes, post war (50's) before going to sea.
Rgds.
Dave

[Tim Gibbs]

For those of us with a fascination and/or addiction to weird engines , there is a book (>550 pages!) that may cure us:
"Opposed Piston Engines, Evolution, Use and Future Applications" by Jean-Pierre Pirault and Martin Flint.

[Malcolm G]

Nearly eighty quid! (£75.24 on Amazon)
I think I might have to take a bit of time to think about that....

[Engine Serang]

Originally Posted by Tim Gibbs

"Opposed Piston Engines, Evolution, Use and Future Applications" by Jean-Pierre Pirault and Martin Flint.

I'll buy a copy and give it to someone I don't like.
Perhaps I should buy a dozen.

[Dartskipper]

Has anybody tried to understand how a rotary engine, such as were used in Sopwith Camels, actually works? That is definitely weird machinery! I have a book with an exploded diagram of a rotary engine and it seems to me to be as easy to understand as some of the popular advanced Soduko puzzles in the morning paper.

All I can extract from the description is that the crankshaft is fixed and the crankcase complete with cylinders rotates around it. I got lost trying to figure out how fuel is delivered to the combustion chambers.

[Malcolm G]

Getting the fuel air mix to the cylinders - There is a big carburettor on the back of the (fixed) crankcase. The mixture feeds into the crankcase, like on a small two stroke, and is distributed up inlet pipes to each cylinder.
The valves are opened by two monster cams, in the crankcase, and pushrods.
There is also a total loss lubricating system.

The part that I have never been able to fully engage with is how they got the power from the magneto to the spark plugs. I have guessed that there was some sort of slip ring, also in the crankcase.

[Farmer John]

I have a manual that covers the Armstrong Siddeley "Cheetah", "Tiger" and "Lynx" rotary engines, you could teach the basics to almost anyone and take most it apart with a handful of tools. They must have been super-robust.

[Tim Gibbs]

Originally Posted by Malcolm G

Nearly eighty quid! (£75.24 on Amazon)
I think I might have to take a bit of time to think about that....

She is weighing up it's value against the Doxford crankcase door I had lusted after.

[Dartskipper]

Posts #22 & 23.

Thanks chaps. The other slightly puzzling aspect was the throttle control. All I could find out was that the engine basically ran continuously at maximum revs and the pilot controlled power when landing by "blipping" a cut-out switch to the spark plugs.

The lubricating system used castor oil or similar I believe, and so apart from having to suffer a fairly common problem with "piles" from sitting in a hard seat at high altitudes, pilots of the Camel had to put up with being doused in the escaping castor oil, which undoubtedly had the same effect on their bodies at 15,000 feet that it would on the ground.